Episode 268
Former Mets Manager Mickey Callaway
Hosts Mike Guidone and Chris Caputo welcome former New York Mets manager Mickey Callaway for an in-depth conversation about the challenges of managing at the highest level of professional baseball. Callaway shares stories from his time with both the Mets and the Cleveland organization, offering insight into leadership, team dynamics, and handling pressure in a demanding market like New York. He talks about staying positive during tough losing streaks, building strong relationships with players, and the importance of mentorship in creating a cohesive team. The discussion also touches on the current struggles of both the Mets and Yankees, exploring what it takes to turn a season around. Callaway’s experiences give listeners a behind-the-scenes look at the balance between player performance, clubhouse culture, and media scrutiny that comes with being a Major League manager.
Takeaways:
- Mickey Callaway emphasized the importance of player leadership in a successful team dynamic, particularly during tough seasons.
- He discussed the challenges of managing a team in New York, highlighting the intense media scrutiny and fan expectations.
- Callaway shared insights on the preparation and strategies that contributed to the success of the Cleveland pitching staff during his tenure.
- The discussion included reflections on the current struggles of the Mets and the necessity for a positive managerial approach during losing streaks.
Transcript
The views expressed in the following program do not necessarily represent those of the.
Speaker B:Staff, management or owners of wgbb.
Speaker B:Live from the WGPB studios in Merrick, New York, this is Sports Talk New York.
Speaker A: : Speaker A: -: Speaker A:I'm your host, Mike Widone, joined as always by the man we call Cappy, Chris Caputo.
Speaker A:Looking forward to a fun show tonight.
Speaker A:Going to be joined very shortly by former Mets manager Mickey Calloway.
Speaker A:Talk about his experience in managing on the big league level.
Speaker A:What's he's what he's up to now.
Speaker A:Dive in a little bit about maybe if he was in a situation that the Mets were in right now, what would you do?
Speaker A:But before we do any of that, Kathy, welcome back to the program.
Speaker A:I appreciate you pitch hitting for me full two weeks ago.
Speaker A:And we're back in action.
Speaker B:Yeah, thanks for getting back in the studio with me.
Speaker B:We did talk with Zach Scott last time about the trade deadline and a little bit with some of the prospects.
Speaker B:And you know, it was interesting to kind of break down as the trade deadline was was happening and what moves people might make.
Speaker B:And I think kind of puts teams in a situation where they are now.
Speaker B:Some teams went for it and made a move and maybe have gone 9:1 in the last week and a half.
Speaker B:And other teams kind of sat back and said maybe we're just going to see what we have and you know, we'll get into that.
Speaker B:But there's, there's a lot of frustration in the New York area.
Speaker B:Yankees, Mets, both are having a tough time over the last few months and it really has not gotten much better in the last two weeks.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:From a talk show standpoint or even from a fan standpoint, you know, thank God there's some, some football on the horizon, but that can go stale pretty quickly as well.
Speaker A:But still a lot of baseball to be played.
Speaker A:You know, we're in early August, but it's definitely it's not looking good at the moment and some things have got to change on both ends.
Speaker A:But before we get a little deeper, dive into that.
Speaker A:We are very happy to be joined tonight by former Mets manager, former pitching coach, had an outstanding run with the Cleveland Indians.
Speaker A:We're going to call them the Cleveland Indians because that was the name of the team at that point.
Speaker A:But we're joined by Mickey Calloway.
Speaker A:Mickey, Mike and Chris here in New York.
Speaker A:How are you?
Speaker C:Hi, Mike and Chris.
Speaker C:I'm doing well.
Speaker C:How are you guys?
Speaker A:We are doing fantastic and we're so happy to be joined by you tonight.
Speaker A:It really, you know, we want to talk to you about your career, obviously, but just kind of get a little bit of a different perspective, you know, with any baseball team.
Speaker A:Kind of going through the things that we're seeing here in New York at the moment.
Speaker A:But, you know, again, welcome to the program and, you know, hope all is well.
Speaker A:Just a quick, quick question for you right now.
Speaker A:You know, we're going to get into your career, but what are you doing baseball wise at the moment?
Speaker A:I believe you're working with some young pitchers.
Speaker C:Yes, I am.
Speaker C:I'm actually working for a. I don't know if you guys recall Ed Easley.
Speaker C:He caught in the big leagues a little bit for the St. Louis Cardinals and he has a baseball organization here in the Memphis area.
Speaker C:And I'm kind of roving around to his older teams and helping out the coaches and players.
Speaker C:And then I'm also doing some baseball pitching lessons on the side.
Speaker C:And I am really enjoying it.
Speaker C:It's so good to work with these young kids and see them really make changes very quickly.
Speaker C:So I'm blessed and loving life here.
Speaker B:So, Mickey Criss here.
Speaker B:I just wanted to ask you when, you know, you tried to put yourself in a player standpoint and, you know, I know that didn't last for you too long in the major leagues, but I think that just shows how hard it is to make it to that level.
Speaker B:What made you make the transition from a player to a coach and how did that go for you?
Speaker C:Well, you know, I tried to play as long as I could.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I always kind of knew, you know, it'd be difficult for me to really, really compete at the major league level just because my style stuff, my fastball was a little short, my curveball didn't really have the bite that we liked.
Speaker C:So I just kind of grinded out some years in the minor leagues and got, you know, a few years in the big league pitching.
Speaker C:Not with great success, but I really enjoyed my time playing in the major leagues.
Speaker C:So, you know, my goal really early on, probably halfway through my career was, you know what?
Speaker C:I want to be a coach, you know, at the major league level.
Speaker C:So I just tried to play as long as I could, got as much experience overseas, you know, able to communicate with people from different countries, learning how it is to Play in a different country.
Speaker C:Because when you're dealing with those guys that are coming over to the United States and they're not from here, it's a difficult thing, you know, and it doesn't matter how much money you're making, it's a difficult thing to be away from home and family and play in the big league.
Speaker C:So that experience really was able to help me communicate with those players.
Speaker C:And, you know, I really enjoyed my time playing, for sure.
Speaker A:Well, I'm sure it's a big difference between, you know, Major League Baseball and when you went overseas, you went over to Asia to, you know, to play, but is it still kind of baseball is baseball, no matter where you are, in terms of playing professionally and just, you know, everyone's kind of focus and intensity on making it to the next level?
Speaker C:It really is.
Speaker C:You know, everybody over in Korea, for the most part, they're trying to get over here.
Speaker C:Everybody in Japan is playing and wanting to get over here, especially the foreigners that are trying to, you know, keep their careers up like I did, going over to Asia, playing.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:But you know what great experience over there.
Speaker C:And, you know, it is baseball as usual.
Speaker C:You know, the game is the game is the game, no matter what country you're in.
Speaker C:And, you know, I had, let's see, we had two foreigners on the team, me and another guy, and we had an interpreter, but you really didn't need one when you're working with the coaches.
Speaker C:Even though he didn't speak the same language.
Speaker C:You know, baseball is kind of a universal language when it comes down to strategery and stuff like that.
Speaker B: with the Indians prior to the: Speaker B: guys made the World Series in: Speaker B:You had Corey Kluber there winning a Cy Young.
Speaker B: games in: Speaker B:What is it about the Cleveland organization, including yourself, that allows pitchers to succeed in that situation?
Speaker C:You know, we really tried to dot every I and cross every T when it came to preparation.
Speaker C:You know, you have to stay healthy if you want to have a good season.
Speaker C:We also really allowed our pitchers to embrace pitching deep into games at that point, which I think is kind of fallen by the wayside a little bit.
Speaker C:So our.
Speaker C:Our starters hauled a lot of innings.
Speaker C:I think we were up in the top, you know, two or three every year as far as innings pitched by starters.
Speaker C:And I really think that formula worked.
Speaker C:We had a great bullpen.
Speaker C:But, you know, wherever you are, it's all about being blessed with good, good players and we had great pitchers with, with Cleveland.
Speaker C:We had there for about five years putting up some very impressive record breaking numbers.
Speaker A:And it certainly seemed, you know, for the city of Cleveland, which always got, I think, kind of a bad rap in professional sports and just, I think it's a lovely city.
Speaker A:Chris, actually, you know, he spent some time working there, just such a great time for Cleveland Indians and for the organization.
Speaker A:And like you said, along those lines, I wanted to ask you, you worked under Terry Francona and it just seems, wherever he goes, he just seems to a.
Speaker A:He wins, but you just hear great things about him.
Speaker A:Can you talk a little bit about Terry and what it was like working under him and some of the things you took with you to your first managerial stop?
Speaker C:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker C:You know, Terry is such a relaxed person on a daily basis that he kind of takes all of the pressure away from the players.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:He focuses on processes and stuff like that and understands that this is a very difficult game to play and he has a lot of grace for the players when it comes to dealing with them.
Speaker C:So that is definitely one thing I tried to take away from is, look, hey, always protect the players.
Speaker C:Make sure they know that you understand their frustrations because this is a difficult game.
Speaker C:And that's probably one of the things that he did the most.
Speaker C:On top of that, he's one of the most giving people that you'll ever be around.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:He really took care of the coaching staff and really helped educate us on baseball in general.
Speaker C:It wasn't just, okay, you guys do this and that.
Speaker C:He really collaborated with everybody on the staff and we would pick his brain.
Speaker C:His knowledge of the game is next to no one.
Speaker C:So he's just all around amazing leader and really laid back, you know, and I think those traits and those positive traits that he had, you know, really kept you from going into these negative, you know, spirals that you see teams go in because, you know, it can get a little hairy out there when things aren't going your way.
Speaker C:And then, you know, guys start kind of, you know, clubhouse, you kind of lose them a little bit and they start, you know, bickering at each other.
Speaker C:But he really kept everything positive and laid back and stress free.
Speaker B: So, Mickey, you started the: Speaker B:Can you talk a little bit about what it was like in the beginning?
Speaker B:Because the Mets did start out 111 that year.
Speaker B:You got rosters of like Kevin Ploecki and Austin Jackson and you guys start out the season 11 1.
Speaker B:What was it like in the beginning?
Speaker B:You know, taking over for Terry Collins and leading that team to a good start.
Speaker C:Oh, it was really fun.
Speaker C:You know, obviously it was my first spring training as a manager, and my goal was to get out of spring training and get clicking on the right note.
Speaker C:You know, I think that manager's huge responsibility during an entire baseball season is managing spring training the right way so you can come into the season clicking on all cylinders, everybody's healthy, so you can get off to a nice start and kind of, you know, hand it over to the players as the season goes on.
Speaker C:So, you know, I was really proud of the start we had both years I was there, but I really, really enjoyed that 111 start.
Speaker C:Obviously, it was very exciting.
Speaker C:You know, baseball in New York is like playoff baseball in Cleveland on a daily basis.
Speaker C:So there's no better place to coach or manage or be around baseball than in New York.
Speaker C:You know, obviously there's pressure to win on a nightly basis, which is something that you always want to be there.
Speaker C:But it is the most Electric playoff atmosphere Baseball, 162 game schedule I've ever been around, and I. I loved it.
Speaker A:Once again, we're joined by Mickey Calloway, former manager of the New York Mets, pitching coach extraordinaire with the Cleveland organization here on WGBB on Long Island.
Speaker A:And Mickey, along with that, you know, obviously, Chris and I are both Met fans.
Speaker A:It was a fantastic start.
Speaker A:As you mentioned, your first year 11 one and out of the gate, and just that even early in the season, it was electric.
Speaker A:Each game there at Citi Field, and the excitement was palpable.
Speaker A:When you were in the process of interviewing and getting ready to become a manager, you know, obviously you spent a lot of time in baseball, in Major League Baseball, as a pitching coach.
Speaker A:Was that your ultimate goal to become a manager?
Speaker A:Or was it something where you just.
Speaker A:You had obviously, that great success and you worked for Terry Franconen, who was a tremendous advocate of yours.
Speaker A:What were your thoughts while you were a pitching coach?
Speaker A:Was it like, you know, what, I want to move up, or was it something that just kind of happened organically?
Speaker C:Yeah, I love being a pitching coach, but I first and foremost love leadership.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:That is something I'm very passionate about.
Speaker C:I study about it, I read about it as much as I can, and I always wanted to be in a leadership role of some sort.
Speaker C:And, you know, when you're a pitching coach, you're leading 12, 12 pitchers.
Speaker C:When you're a manager, you're leading basically the, you know, organization from on down from the gm.
Speaker C:So, you know, that that is a goal I had for sure even early on.
Speaker C:You know, I, I obviously knew going in there wasn't many pitching guys to become managers in the history of baseball.
Speaker C:But you know, it was a lofty goal, but it was something that I really wanted to do.
Speaker C:And I think my last two years as being a pitching coach in Cleveland, I really started to consider it being a huge possibility.
Speaker C:So I studied even more, you know, about all facets of the game and started to really research the analytics and kind of dive deep into that type stuff.
Speaker C:So, you know, it's something that I had a lot of passion for leadership and something that just kind of, you know, transpired over some pretty quality seasons there in Cleveland, leading 12 pitchers.
Speaker B:So, Mickey, here in New York, the Mets have now gone on a streak of losing seven in a row, including like 11 of 12.
Speaker B:And you know, at some point there were 20 some odd games over.500.
Speaker B:And things have now come down where they're five and a half games behind the Phillies.
Speaker B: You know, in: Speaker B:How do you, how do you feel you handled in, in that time and what is a manager's role in that situation when the team goes into a spell where it's hard to get out of?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:So with that, you know, and I'm not sure a lot of people would agree in New York, but you have to stay positive, right?
Speaker C:You, you have to sit up there in front of the media, pick up the good things that are going on because baseball is a game of streaks.
Speaker C: In: Speaker B:That was unbelievable.
Speaker C:I think the rest of the season we were two games below.500.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So without that 22 game win streak or whatever it was, or however many games above.500 were, we weren't going to be there.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So baseball is a game of streaks.
Speaker C:You have to understand that you might lose 7 or 9 or 11 of 12.
Speaker C:Well at some point.
Speaker C:But hey, the Mets are still in it and hopefully the managers in there saying the same thing.
Speaker C:Hey, we're still in it.
Speaker D:Guys.
Speaker C:I know this is a tough stretch.
Speaker C:Let's keep our heads up.
Speaker C:We have players to be able to do this.
Speaker C:You know, we got to obviously stay healthy and throw strikes.
Speaker C:You know, I think one of the things that might have haunted Nets to this point is they're based on balls.
Speaker C:They walk a lot of guys and they don't strike a lot of guys out.
Speaker C:You know, it's kind of mediocre, kind of across the board.
Speaker C:When you're looking at their numbers, you know, as far as batting average, run score, they're just, you know, they kind of hang around the middle of the pack.
Speaker C:But where they're really poor at, I think they're 27th in baseball is walking guys and then they're not striking a ton of guys out.
Speaker C:You know, if you're going to be 27th and walks, you better be first or second or third strikeout.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:To kind of counter, counteract that.
Speaker C:So, you know, they haven't given up a ton of runs.
Speaker C:Their ERA is not that high.
Speaker C:They're, they're on base percentage and stuff is just mediocre.
Speaker C:The one thing I did, did look into their batting.
Speaker C:You know, they're, they're, they're very unlucky at the plate.
Speaker C:So I think, you know.
Speaker C:Yeah, right.
Speaker C:Their hard hit balls are there.
Speaker C:Their batting average on balls and play is very low.
Speaker C:I think they're down maybe 27th or something, hitting about 275.
Speaker C:And that usually kind of works its way up to the.300 mark.
Speaker C:And if that happens, you know, some of those, you know, games kind of turn the other way, but, you know, it's getting late in the season, so you don't know that it's necessarily going to turn around at this point.
Speaker C:But the manager's got to be positive.
Speaker C:You know, the players have to see a manager that's positive and not panicking because if the manager panics, then the players are going to panic.
Speaker C:You know, you're the leader out there, you know, and no matter how hard it is for maybe fans or somebody else to understand the positivity part, when things are going bad, you have to keep on doing it.
Speaker C:You know, I think that's one thing I like about Aaron Boone over there with the Yankees.
Speaker C:Obviously things aren't going their way this year, but in the past he's, he's always kept, you know, pretty upbeat locker room and it seems to work out pretty good for them.
Speaker C:I know they haven't won a World Series, which is everybody's goal, but, you know, that is not an easy task, for sure.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And especially with the Yankee organization, any season that doesn't end in a World Series, it's a failure.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker A:Which is such a shame.
Speaker A:I wanted to ask you, Mickey, behind the scenes, you know, in the situations you're talking about, obviously being positive is, as you said, is just paramount.
Speaker A:And, you know, fans and media maybe don't understand that because It's a team dynamic.
Speaker A:But as a human being, as the leader of the team, when you're going through those kind of down times, is it something in professional sports, in a major league clubhouse where if a guy is maybe dogging it a little bit or is just kind of down, is it something where you can pull them aside and kind of get into them a little bit or is that just overrated and kind of like coach speak of people who aren't really in the game on the professional level?
Speaker C:Oh no, no.
Speaker C:I think that definitely has to be there.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:You have to have the ability to pull a guy in and tell him to get after it.
Speaker C:You know, obviously that's a manager's job on, on a, on a good team.
Speaker C:Great.
Speaker C:And I'm sure you guys have heard this quote before, right?
Speaker C:Good teams, the coaches lead great teams and championship teams, the players lead.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:So ideally you have a player in that clubhouse like David Wright or somebody who kind of steps in and kind of does that for you because every time, 100% of the time, the players are going to respond better to their peers.
Speaker C:You know, I had to get in some guys asses when I was there and you know, sometimes it doesn't end up great.
Speaker C:They go in, they complain that I yelled at them or something to other players and then it just doesn't turn out great.
Speaker C:But when you got the team and, and the players doing that in the locker room and kind of managing that locker room and making sure everybody's hustling and doing the things they can, then that's where you become that championship caliber team.
Speaker C:And that's why it's so important when you're building a team to make sure you get the right players.
Speaker C:And I thought we had that, you know, with the Mets when I was there and I thought we were on our way.
Speaker C:You know, we went from what, 70 wins the year before I got there to 77 to 86.
Speaker C:And I could feel the young Alonzos and McNeil starting to really mesh and I was really looking forward to that third year to see if we could do something special.
Speaker C:Unfortunately it wasn't in the cards for me, but I really enjoyed my time there as a leader in that clubhouse.
Speaker A:Yeah, that brings up another great point that seems to be such a double edged sword with New York.
Speaker A:It's great to be a manager.
Speaker A:It's great on the biggest stage, if you're doing great, you're a hero.
Speaker A:If you're treading water, unfortunately, just don't get the leash that I'M sure you know, that resume in practically any other baseball town, you're by far coming back, and that's a tough thing to deal with.
Speaker A:Those two years, though, you brought up a couple of names.
Speaker A:Was there someone developing?
Speaker A:I know you said Alonzo and McNeil, but was there someone in the clubhouse that you could kind of count on at that time who was, you know, a solid presence, or was it just such a young group that you really needed.
Speaker A:You needed as the manager to continue to develop those guys in the leadership?
Speaker C:You know, I think we had some really great guys on that team.
Speaker C:We had, you know, the Todd Fraziers and guys like that that were a little bit older, the Jay Bruces.
Speaker C:I mean, I think the problem with that was, is at this stage in their career, it was maybe a little bit more difficult to do what we're talking about.
Speaker C:You really want, you know, a Francisco Lindor in your locker room.
Speaker C:That guy is one of the best guys I've ever been around when.
Speaker C:When he was a rookie, he was leading our team in Cleveland.
Speaker C:So, you know, we really need someone of that caliber, one of your better, better players to be able to step up.
Speaker C:You know, you had David Wright when things were going well, when Terry was there.
Speaker C:Well, I got to see quite a bit of David around the clubhouse, but he wasn't playing.
Speaker C:So it was.
Speaker C:It was kind of hard for him to really step into that role and embrace it like he had in the past.
Speaker C:So you really, you know, you really need one of your better performers to be out there and be able to lead, in my opinion.
Speaker B:Real quick.
Speaker C:What?
Speaker B:Just explain having Jacob deGrom go out on the mound every fifth day for you.
Speaker D:What.
Speaker B:What was it like to.
Speaker B:To just.
Speaker B:I don't know how much you coached him up or, you know, the pitching staff did, but what was it like to have him on your staff?
Speaker C:I mean, I don't think anybody needs to coach Jacob DeGrault.
Speaker C:That guy is just an unbelievable talent when he comes onto the mound, and really just an unbelievable athlete all around.
Speaker C:You know, you watch him hit, you watch him out there running around, fielding ground balls before the game.
Speaker C:The guy's an incredible athlete, and to be able to watch him pitch, you know, I was there for Corey Kluber's 2 Cy Youngs.
Speaker C:I was there for Jacob deGrom's 2 Cy Youngs, and it's pretty amazing.
Speaker C:You know, it was.
Speaker C:It was nerve wracking for me as a manager.
Speaker C:The one I'll never forget was we were in Philly and Jacob in the middle of his Cy Young run through 44 pitches in the first inning and didn't give up a run.
Speaker C:Wow.
Speaker C:I've never seen, I've never even heard of anything like that.
Speaker C:And I was like, oh great.
Speaker C:Yeah, he does.
Speaker C:The best pitcher on the planet does this when I'm managing him.
Speaker C:And I got to make the decision whether or not the send him back out.
Speaker C:But I think we made the right decision.
Speaker C:We pulled him out of the game after, you know, one inning and he still ended up winning a Cy Young.
Speaker C:So you know, I didn't, I was worried about that one thing really.
Speaker C:But when it comes down to it, no matter what accolades are on the line, you have to take care of guys health or then your team has no chance moving forward.
Speaker C:So we took him out and he ended up finishing with a Cy Young.
Speaker C:And it was awesome.
Speaker C:But that guy is electric.
Speaker C:I mean I can't even.
Speaker C:I think that.
Speaker C:And I have this theory and I might be totally wrong, but I really truly think this.
Speaker C:The reason we couldn't score runs for Jacob deGrom is because all of our hitters are out on the field watching Jacob deGrom make hitting look like the most difficult thing in the world, which it is.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:But he makes it look almost impossible.
Speaker C:And I think that got in our guys head.
Speaker C:Yeah, that and you know, when putting pressure on themselves to go out there and score runs for him because they wanted him to win every game.
Speaker C:Yeah, he was insane.
Speaker C:Yeah, it was awesome.
Speaker B:And it was tough to get him run support then.
Speaker B:But so if that was kind of like the easiest part of your job, what was like the toughest situation that you've had to deal with as a manager in New York?
Speaker C:You know, I think that just the daily grind of just non stop people visiting.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:You always have people in your, in your office, celebrities coming on the field.
Speaker C:You're having to kind of, you know, make the rounds and be introduced to tons of people while still trying to pay attention to the players at times the best you can.
Speaker C:That was really the biggest challenge for me.
Speaker C:You know, I came from Cleveland where we had two, two beat writers.
Speaker C:There was no celebrities coming in, so I got to observe Tito kind of just make his way around the clubhouse casually and have, you know, these one on one meetings and stuff.
Speaker C:And when I got to New York I was like, oh holy crap, when am I going to meet with guys?
Speaker C:You know, when am I going to be able to pay attention to some of the guys on the team or talk to the coaching staff?
Speaker C:You know, I was there at 11am every day trying to get a workout in and then it would start and it was nonstop until batting practice.
Speaker C:When I threw the first group of bp, that was really my first, first break.
Speaker C:And then by that time, you're kind of going into, you know, second, third, fourth groups of BP and guys are getting ready for the game.
Speaker C:So that's my biggest challenge, is just managing.
Speaker C:When could I really pay attention to the players like I'd like to?
Speaker C:And, you know, that's just a different dynamic in New York.
Speaker B:Mike and I.
Speaker B:Aside, do you feel like the New York media gave you too tough of a time during certain situations?
Speaker C:You know what I mean?
Speaker C:Just know, you know, I kind of look at managing this way.
Speaker C:Like I've been doing a podcast a little bit with, with some, some, some people and, you know, they ask questions about managers decisions and stuff.
Speaker C:And the one thing I'll always say is I'll never criticize a manager because the manager is the only one that knows all of the information if the guy's hurting, if the guy didn't sleep last night for some reason.
Speaker C:And all of these things, a manager can't stand up in front of the sports reporters and the fans to talk about, right?
Speaker C:You have to take care of the organization and the players that are in that clubhouse.
Speaker C:So I think that was a challenge as well as, you know, you really can't give all the information.
Speaker C:So to really give the sports writers what they deserve, as much of the truth as you possibly can without it being a, you know, tactical disadvantage.
Speaker C:When you're going to play, you know, the Tampa Bay Rays next week, you can't reveal that Jacob deGrom has a little bit of a, you know, sore thumb or whatever when he's pitching.
Speaker C:So, you know, that, that kind of made it difficult.
Speaker C:And I can understand, you know, the dynamic in New York where the fans, they want what they want, right?
Speaker C:And they don't want to sit there and read about Kumbaya every day because that's not reality, right?
Speaker C:The fans, the base, baseball is for the fans.
Speaker C:And I think the sports writers in New York give them what they want to hear, and that's totally fine by me.
Speaker C:So I didn't feel, you know, that it was unfair or anything.
Speaker C:Obviously it was a challenge at times to read some of the stuff I did, but that's part of the game there in New York and I really thoroughly enjoyed it.
Speaker C:Like I said, baseball playoff atmosphere every night.
Speaker C:I'll take it 162 times a year.
Speaker A:Well, we appreciate your candor because that's something that very often, you know, you don't hear.
Speaker A:And it's a real great fact of life that you're protecting your team, you're managing your group and you're trying to give, you know, I don't want to say sound bites, but you're trying to give the reporters their due and give them their time.
Speaker A:And it's got to be a very, very tough tightrope to maneuver.
Speaker A: ust wanted to check in now in: Speaker A:Are you looking to get back into managing coaching on the professional level?
Speaker A:Where do you stand right now and what are your immediate goals?
Speaker C:Yeah, you know, I just bought a Ranch, a 50 acre ranch here in North Mississippi, just south of Memphis.
Speaker C:So I bought chickens and ducks the other day and try to raise some cattle over here.
Speaker C:So I'm doing that right now.
Speaker C:But there's no doubt I love to get back at that.
Speaker C:So if that opportunity arises, I will definitely take it.
Speaker C:I miss the game.
Speaker C:I miss professional baseball.
Speaker C:I miss that level of competitiveness that you see on a nightly basis.
Speaker C:I miss the pressure.
Speaker C:So, you know, I would love to obviously get back to the game.
Speaker C:I've been eligible for a few years now.
Speaker C:I haven't really reached out to anybody.
Speaker C:If somebody wants me, I'm sure they'll reach out someday and I will gladly consider.
Speaker A:Well, you certainly proved you can do it and you did.
Speaker A:Have you improved each year in New York?
Speaker A:And we hope you get the chance to do that again.
Speaker A:We can't thank you enough for all your time this evening.
Speaker A:We're rooting for you as well, and hopefully we can have you back on again in the future.
Speaker A:But in the short term, thank you for your insights and, you know, it really gives us an extra boost here in looking at two New York teams that are struggling a little bit.
Speaker A:But, you know, now we can talk about it a little differently and I know Chris feels the same way.
Speaker C:Yeah, no, I appreciate you guys having me.
Speaker C:I'd love to get back on and hopefully, you know, both New York teams can go on a 9 0, 100 run here and get back into the thick of things because you need that playoff based on New York every year, that's for sure.
Speaker B:All right, well, thank you.
Speaker B:As a member of the 7 Lion army, we really appreciate all the work you put into the time in New York.
Speaker C:Appreciate it, fellas.
Speaker C:Thanks for having me.
Speaker A:Absolutely right.
Speaker A:Mickey Calloway FORMER New York met manager had great success in Cleveland, and we're hoping for good things for him in the future.
Speaker A:We're going to take a quick break and then get back a little more baseball talk here on wgbb, Sports Talk New York.
Speaker C:You are listening to Sports Talk New York.
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Speaker C:You're listening to Sports Talk New York.
Speaker B:On Long Island's wgb.
Speaker B:And now back to the show.
Speaker A: ,: Speaker A: in and join US Again, that's: Speaker A:Talk a little baseball.
Speaker A:We can if you have any questions about Mickey Calloway and his great interview we just had with him, unfortunately, we had a little bit of a technical issue with his phone, but we were able to get through it.
Speaker A:And, you know, again, he gave us some great insights on what it's like managing in New York.
Speaker A:I think we could have probably, you know, done another half hour with him and I'm hoping to do that on a little clearer signal next time because he really, he besides the Mets, you know, Cap, he as we were talking off air, he had some interesting personalities that he managed and worked with.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I mean, he had to deal with a lot of, you know, shots here in New York, people in Cleveland.
Speaker B:And, you know, for people who might have looked up some of his past, he had to take some time away from baseball for some penalties that he, you know, unfortunately.
Speaker A:Yeah, obviously we weren't going to delve into that, but he admitted that, you know, I think also here's a guy grew up in Tennessee, you know, went to school in Mississippi, then gets into professional baseball.
Speaker A:Now he's in Cleveland, which is no small potatoes market, but it's Cleveland.
Speaker A:It's not.
Speaker A:And then boom, his first real managerial job in professional baseball is in New York.
Speaker B:It's different.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I thought, you know, again, I thought he did real well.
Speaker A:I mean, I don't know what else was going on behind the scenes at that time, but he did, you know, he had that maybe he was a victim, unfortunately, of that great start because they did start out so well.
Speaker A:Then they Hit the skids.
Speaker A:And that first year was not.
Speaker A:Was not what he was looking for.
Speaker A:Second year, better.
Speaker A:But, you know, the Met ownership and.
Speaker B:Everything, it was somewhat trying to change.
Speaker B:You got to also remember they brought in Brody Van Wagenen to take over for Sandy Alderson, who had stepped away.
Speaker B:So you had a guy who was Jacob deGrom's agent is now your boss.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:So you're dealing with a.
Speaker B:Definitely a different situation.
Speaker B:And, you know, I think that that kind of plays.
Speaker B:Part of it is now you have a guy above you who you just.
Speaker B:It's a different person than it was the first year.
Speaker B:And you have guys like Marcus Stroman on your roster, guys like, you know, bringing in Edwin Diaz and Robinson Cano and, you know, having to get rid of Matt Harvey halfway through the season because some of the mistakes he made, it's like, you know, there was some behind the scenes stuff that we didn't talk about that were not easy to deal with.
Speaker B:David Wright had to retire in one.
Speaker A:Of his seasons, and it seems like he would definitely be willing to get into that.
Speaker A:It's a sticky wicket because he's trying to get back into baseball.
Speaker A:You know, not that we lob softball questions at him tonight, but I would like to dive into a little bit of that.
Speaker A:But for me, as someone who just coaches sports and as a teacher, it's fascinating when you hear guys like him talk about their leadership and being positive all the time and then getting in someone's butt.
Speaker A:And it's just.
Speaker A:I really.
Speaker A:I mean, I could sit and talk to guys like that for hours, just picking their brain, what it's like.
Speaker A:And it's just, you know, what a privilege it must be to manage on that level.
Speaker A:But the heartache you go through as.
Speaker B:A pitching coach, excellent.
Speaker B:I just think he ran into a tough time in New York and wasn't able to get himself out of debt.
Speaker B:Another guy who I'd love to talk to about stuff like this, people who go through the rankings like you and I, Mike, like a Nate Oates at Alabama basketball, a guy who was a high school math teacher, then went to the University of Buffalo and eventually winds up at Alabama.
Speaker B:Like, this is a guy who went through the grind just to get where he was.
Speaker B:And he was coaching, you know, high school basketball and coaching math a few years before that.
Speaker B:So those are the situations where it's like, wow, like, the only difference between him and us is he has to do it on a bigger spotlight.
Speaker B:But they.
Speaker B:These guys come and they talk and they say, hey, listen, you know, my job is to take all of the tough stuff and not really talk about it, but he was given a tough time by some of the media and he had to go on the air and kind of, you know, take some of that stuff and put it down.
Speaker B:But you know where we are with the Mets right now, Mike, it's, it's tough.
Speaker B:Well, every day, you know, let's start like last week.
Speaker B:They were not doing well.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:To begin with, it's, it's been tough.
Speaker B:I think the Mets and the Yankees have the third and fourth worst record since June 13th.
Speaker B:Somewhere around like 20 and 30 and, and you know, 20 and 32, something like that.
Speaker B:Between the two of them, things weren't going well.
Speaker B:And people might say today or last night or whatever was rock bottom, but being at that game last Wednesday and them not having a hit in the ninth inning, that was pretty bad.
Speaker A:It was, you know, we, Chris and I went, we went to the game and it was an afternoon game, very beautiful day, good sized crowd because obviously you have the camps there.
Speaker A:But there was, it was a weird feeling though.
Speaker A:I mean, going to baseball games, we're going to met games, you know, for 40 plus years, it.
Speaker A:Just walking around the stadium, I didn't feel like I was even at a major league game.
Speaker A:It was weird.
Speaker B:Yeah, it was kind of a little relaxed and you can hear people on the way and say, oh, we're going to win today, we're going to win today.
Speaker B:And listen, I'm don't, I don't like to call myself pessimistic.
Speaker B:I try to say I'm somewhat of a down realist.
Speaker A:You're a realist.
Speaker B:You know, I see what's going on and I follow the pattern.
Speaker B:And I'm not a person that says, oh, because we've lost four in a row, we're going to win the fifth.
Speaker B:For me, it's, we have to find a way to get out of this rut or else it's going to continue.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:And it's just going to keep going.
Speaker B:And it started with the first play of the game, knocking the glove off of the pitcher.
Speaker B:He hustles after the ball.
Speaker B:Probably something one of the Mets pitchers wouldn't have done.
Speaker A:No, they would have waited.
Speaker B:Throws the first and gets the guy out.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Works his way through that inning and you know, a couple of walks here or there.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:A couple of hiccups later on.
Speaker B:But Mike, that game went on and on.
Speaker B:And what were you and I talking about?
Speaker B:The guy's Got a no hitter.
Speaker A:A no hitter, Absolutely.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:You get and you start.
Speaker A:And even early, I think we, you know, third inning or so.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:We're like, hey, you know, it's not.
Speaker A:This is not, you know, fancy.
Speaker B:Became quicker in it.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Because remember, that first inning was like 33 pitches.
Speaker A:I mean, we walked.
Speaker A:We walked around.
Speaker A:We had a couple young.
Speaker A:Young kids with us and.
Speaker A:And families, and we.
Speaker A:We did a quick walk, and before you know it, it was like the six thinning.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And a couple of runs for the other team.
Speaker B:And now you're counting down our outs.
Speaker B:15, 12, nine, six.
Speaker B:And now you're getting a six.
Speaker B:And you had two different people, sets of people at the game, right?
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:So what was it, Mike?
Speaker B:What were two sets of people?
Speaker A:You had.
Speaker A:Well, you had a lot of Cleveland fans there.
Speaker B:Correct.
Speaker B:You had people there.
Speaker B:You know, we were sitting near the Cleveland dugout.
Speaker A:But then you had a lot of Met fans who were kind of rooting for a no hitter.
Speaker B:So you had the Met fans rooting for the no hitter.
Speaker B:And then you have the other people who were just dying to break it up.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:And listen, if you've gotten that far and your team's down for nothing, I'd love to see history.
Speaker A:Of course.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker A:And not to interrupt you, but, I mean, seriously.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's not as if this team has been playing a certain way to where you're like, you know what?
Speaker A:They're sharp.
Speaker A:They're just having a down moment.
Speaker A:They're going to continue to fight.
Speaker A:They'll.
Speaker A:It wasn't.
Speaker A:It was not as.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:It was not as if I felt I was going against my Met fandom saying.
Speaker A:I mean, I literally thought they got no shot to win this game.
Speaker C:Nothing.
Speaker A:So why not see some history?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:It wasn't like it was one nothing.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:You know, and then, like, you know, you could see a guy come up to the plate, and it was almost like, you know, someone was thinking early in the game, you know, not the ninth inning of possibly laying down a bunch, and it was like, oh, boy, you can't do that.
Speaker B:And it just got to that last inning, and I was rooting for it, and I.
Speaker B:And, you know, I think you had said to me you thought maybe it would come up to.
Speaker B:Well, I. Alonzo hitting the game.
Speaker A:I didn't want to say anything.
Speaker A:I shot.
Speaker A:I shot you a text.
Speaker A:I said.
Speaker A:I said, they're going to get two out, and then.
Speaker A:And then Pete's going to hit a home run.
Speaker A:It wound up being one Out.
Speaker A:And Soto.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker B:So Soto hits the home run.
Speaker A:All right, but I want to go ahead.
Speaker A:So I'd like to rewind just a second with that and I.
Speaker A:This is something a guy like Mickey Calloway, I would have loved to ask them and maybe next time I will.
Speaker A:I kind of alluded to it about getting into guys.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:All right, Soto is Soto one.
Speaker A:He's got this incredible contract.
Speaker A:Whatever else, but he is.
Speaker A:He's the highest paid player.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Now he has.
Speaker A:He might not be the greatest leader.
Speaker A:It doesn't seem that way.
Speaker A:He probably didn't sign up for that.
Speaker A:And maybe his contract 10 years from now will be a bargain.
Speaker A:But you cannot have that type of guy.
Speaker A:And let's just take his name out.
Speaker A:Let's just call him Juan Smith.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:Who grounds out.
Speaker A:It's solid.
Speaker A:Grounds out and just jogs to first base.
Speaker A:I mean, listen, I get it.
Speaker A:You're out, you're pro 99 times out of 100 there's not going to be an error.
Speaker A:But I mean, I ran to the bathroom faster than he ran to first base.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, and now we're talking about a team with no life.
Speaker B:There you go.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I understand at times, you know, it's seven nothing in the ninth inning, a ground ball to third.
Speaker B:I don't want him pulling, doing that.
Speaker A:Of course, but I mean, mid fifth.
Speaker A:Yeah, he's, he's just chilling going down that.
Speaker A:So when we talk about the difference of a team last year that had spunk, the.
Speaker A:Oh my God, the grimace like now, can you blame it on one guy?
Speaker A:No, you can't blame it on one guy.
Speaker A:But man, there's a lot to do with it when, when you add a talent like that, but they bring you nothing in terms of the intangibles of the game.
Speaker B:So status veteran for the, for the, the Mets, 60 again.
Speaker B:This is pretty much what they're making this year.
Speaker B:Juan Soto $61 million.
Speaker B:Francisco Lindor $34 million.
Speaker B:Alonzo 30.
Speaker B:Edwin Diaz, 21.
Speaker B:Stalin Marte 20.
Speaker B:Nimmo 20.
Speaker B:Shamania 20.
Speaker B:Frankie Montas, 17.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:And we can get if you'd like, Frankie Montas, 17.
Speaker B:Yeah, we got two years plus a third.
Speaker B:Whoa.
Speaker B:Possible.
Speaker B:All right, Jeff McNeil, 15.
Speaker B:Code I. Senga 15.
Speaker B:Clay Holmes, 13.
Speaker B:Those are just some veterans that are all making double digit million dollars.
Speaker B:You know, this team is not a team that's out there trying to make the playoffs because they have guys who are making two to three million dollars.
Speaker B:No, Ronny Mauricio is making $766,000 fine.
Speaker B:You're gonna throw Vientos and Beatty and Alvarez, they're all making $700,000, okay?
Speaker B:But the rest of these guys are making major money.
Speaker B:And I don't know if anybody's getting on them for the way that they're playing.
Speaker B:And I know that in years past, other managers may have dealt with this.
Speaker B:So we're going to go back to, you know, a couple of years back when after a 9 nothing loss to the Arizona Diamondbacks, Terry Collins came out and said this.
Speaker D:Play the game correctly.
Speaker C:And we're all responsible, Every single one of us.
Speaker C:The coaches, me, the player.
Speaker C:We're all in this together.
Speaker C:There's no one guy to blame.
Speaker C:There's no one guy to point a finger at.
Speaker D:I don't do that.
Speaker D:I have never done that.
Speaker D:Never.
Speaker B:I am a team guy.
Speaker B:I believe in team just as you guys do.
Speaker C:You write a bad story, it's about the paper.
Speaker D:It's about where you came from.
Speaker C:Everybody's in it.
Speaker C:And I believe that today's game, it's going to happen again.
Speaker C:But I know one thing.
Speaker D:Starting tomorrow, we're back fresh.
Speaker D:Starting tomorrow, we're going to get after it here.
Speaker D:And those who don't want to get after it, I will find somebody else who does.
Speaker C:Because in Las Vegas, there's a whole.
Speaker D:Clubhouse full of guys who want to.
Speaker B:Sit in this room, and I'll find them.
Speaker C:That's all I got to say.
Speaker D:I'm done.
Speaker A:Now, that's leadership.
Speaker B:Does Carlos Mendoza need to do something like that?
Speaker B:Or is it Mickey Calloway saying, you got to stay positive.
Speaker B:You got to stay positive?
Speaker A:And that's what.
Speaker B:I didn't name one name.
Speaker B:No, he didn't.
Speaker B:He did not name one person.
Speaker A:But he showed that he.
Speaker A:That he cares in that clip and that he's as passionate.
Speaker A:Now you.
Speaker A:I think that's.
Speaker A:That's a masterclass right there on being the leader, taking the hits, not naming guys, but saying, hey, look, you know where I'm responsible.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:That's what he's coaching me.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker A:And tomorrow we're going to come out and play hard and if you don't, you know, hit the road.
Speaker A:And I don't know Carlos Mendoza, I've never met the man.
Speaker A:You know, he's had some interesting streaks as a manager.
Speaker A:Very streaky.
Speaker A:You don't get this job.
Speaker A:And you're not a Yankee bench coach for.
Speaker A:If you don't know the game well, I'm rooting for him.
Speaker A:I hope he does well.
Speaker A:But I think the time comes, you don't even have to be that passionate.
Speaker A:Just come out and say, hey, look, I realize that we stink and that, you know, not.
Speaker A:We're gonna find a way.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:Get a little zip under you.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's hard to describe.
Speaker B:Tough, frustrating, but we've got to turn the page.
Speaker A:Oh, gosh.
Speaker B:There wasn't a good showing, and they pretty much outplayed us, you know, and when we do.
Speaker B:When we.
Speaker B:When we ask about Frankie Matas, we haven't made a decision yet as of now.
Speaker B:We, you know, we think.
Speaker A:And I get now, like, he's.
Speaker D:I understand.
Speaker B:Strong with that.
Speaker B:You.
Speaker B:You have to step up at some point and say this way of losing a different way every night.
Speaker B:It's got to stop.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker B:And the guys in the clubhouse need to go out and make a stand because we have.
Speaker B:We don't have one guy since June that has a above.700 OPS.
Speaker B:League averages around good guys are around.800.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Not one of these guys is doing something to put themselves on base or to score somebody else.
Speaker A:And there are three, three, quote, unquote, all stars on this team.
Speaker B:And you put Juan Soto in a big situation.
Speaker B:Not happening.
Speaker B:22 out of his 28 home runs, solo.
Speaker A:He's Juan Solo.
Speaker B:Juan Solo.
Speaker B:All right, well, we're going to welcome in here our Mets helper here from the Mets podcast.
Speaker B:James Shiano is going to join us.
Speaker B:And if you want to get any of your frustration out, you now have the mic.
Speaker B:James.
Speaker A:James, help us, please.
Speaker D:What's up, guys?
Speaker D:When I caught on here, you were talking about the clip.
Speaker D:Did Mendoza say something post game that I might have missed about us?
Speaker A:No.
Speaker D:He didn't care of the struggles?
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:That's the point.
Speaker B:We played the Terry Collins after the nine nothing laws were all go down to Vegas type clip.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker D:We so podcast our Twitter account.
Speaker D:We have, like, a yearly ritual.
Speaker D:We post that every single year with the exact same capture.
Speaker D:And Mark and I have a contest with each other to see how many impressions that clip gets year over year.
Speaker D:Every single year, the Mets fans are like, this is exactly what we want.
Speaker B:No, all he said today was, we're very frustrated, but we've got to keep going.
Speaker B:Nobody said it was going to be easy.
Speaker B:Those quotes come every day from Carlos Mendoza.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:The one thing about the fact that there's no fire now, it does give me a little bit more confidence that he's never a fire guy.
Speaker D:So it'd be even crazier if, especially to the media, if suddenly the Fire came out.
Speaker D:I'm just worried about whether or not.
Speaker D:And we can't know this and I guess we'll know tomorrow when the writers put some articles out.
Speaker D:But about fire that could be inside the clubhouse.
Speaker D:Like, I think no matter what, like, I'm fine with these guys not blowing up on the media because this is.
Speaker D:They've never been, they've never been anything besides like cordial with the media, like, friendly, nice.
Speaker D:I think like Mendoza and like Stearns especially, like they have their own little like rapport with the media.
Speaker D:There just needs to be some report of someone inside that room saying or doing something because it's like it has to be.
Speaker D:Whether it be Mendoza or Lindor, Alonzo, Nimoso, and someone has to just open their mouths and be like, we have to get some of these things out in the air right now because there's no, there's no cohesion with this roster.
Speaker D:It's just completely empty on the field.
Speaker C:It's ridiculous.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And before we get into numbers, just the team in general, you know, a lot of people say, oh, it's rock bottom.
Speaker B:And it like, it just happens a different way every time.
Speaker B:Is this just a matter of things kind of going down a bad path and maybe things change at some point or is there major because I'm not a big, you know, Juan Soto's not not allowed to have a laugh in the, in the dugout with Tyrone Taylor.
Speaker B:To see them smile while the Mets are on a seven game losing streak is bad.
Speaker B:I'm not for that.
Speaker B:You know, it's okay to still be a human being, but is it at the point where it's just so bad it's never going to turn around again?
Speaker B:Or do you think that, you know, it's just a law of averages?
Speaker D:I mean, it feels like a little bit of both.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker D:Like, it's kind of fair to think it would be both.
Speaker D:I think the Mets have had some in terms of like the expectations, the player, this team, the players on this team, definitely a lot of bad results.
Speaker D:Things that they were like, this is turning out worse than we thought it was going to.
Speaker D:And then also just a few injuries.
Speaker D:Every team has injuries.
Speaker D:Every team has guys that don't, you know, play up to their standards in particular the year.
Speaker D:But just the fact that like you guys said right before I got on, every single guy is having their, one of their worst stretches of the season at the same time.
Speaker D:But it happens to be two months.
Speaker D:So it's like it's not really the same time.
Speaker D:It's more just like there's a good group coldness.
Speaker C:There's.
Speaker D:I don't know, it's hard.
Speaker D:I mean, you guys watch it every day.
Speaker D:It's hard to explain.
Speaker D:Like, you watch a baseball team lose confidence, you can't really describe it, but you can see it very clearly, like visibly.
Speaker D:That's what this weekend felt like.
Speaker A:I'm not a make change for change sake guy.
Speaker A:It's just not in my nature as well.
Speaker A:And you know, I don't like seeing people fired or whatever else.
Speaker A:But do you think that there's just got to be something, some kind of shake up, you know, new, new hitting coach?
Speaker A:I don't say fire the manager, but just there's got to be something that A, doesn't look desperate, but B, maybe changes something here a little bit because it is desperation time.
Speaker D:I mean, probably any move you make in August, firing a coach probably does look desperate, but also that doesn't really.
Speaker D:I don't know.
Speaker D:Sometimes I don't think these guys care so much about the optics at this point and where this organization is.
Speaker D:Maybe like the past versions of it.
Speaker D:I think right now they're very consistent.
Speaker D:One, state, of course, but also two, definitely realize that there needs to just be a moment.
Speaker D:There needs to be something that galvanizes these guys.
Speaker D:Like the way it's kind of funny looking back, but the team kind of looked like this for a month and a half, two months last season.
Speaker D:And all of a sudden, Jorge Lopez throws like one of the greatest pantries we've ever seen in a baseball field.
Speaker D:All of a sudden, like it's just like, whoa.
Speaker D:Like you just have to.
Speaker D:There needs to be like a Runway for these guys to let some things out.
Speaker D:It seems like there's just something that's just like a blockade, like a mental blockade, team wise.
Speaker D:I don't know, it's just hard to even explain when you watch it every day.
Speaker C:Yep.
Speaker B: ,: Speaker B:James, you know, getting thrown out at home plate the other night, obviously we talk about, you know, we could have put Tyrone Taylor in.
Speaker B:He, you know, has the decisions that Mendoza has made, whether it be who to put in the game, who to take out of the game, who to pinch run.
Speaker B:You know, has that been a little too much for him lately?
Speaker B:Do you think that it's gotten to be a little too much?
Speaker B:Because he seems to.
Speaker B:To have an answer each time, but it seems to me to be the wrong answer.
Speaker D:The Friday game was the first time where I was like, oh, man.
Speaker D:Like, this is a.
Speaker C:This.
Speaker D:This is actually the kind of call that is inexcusably bad.
Speaker D:At least every manager makes crappy bullpen decisions.
Speaker D:Like, this is going to happen across the league no matter what.
Speaker D:Like the pinch hit, pinch run decisions.
Speaker D:Like, I mean, not just the pinch hit decisions.
Speaker D:Like, I understand the gut that Mendoza uses for that and, like, use it well last year.
Speaker D:So it's like, it worked one year, it didn't work the other here.
Speaker D:Okay.
Speaker D:The no pinch run is like, that's like kind of I'm gonna.
Speaker D:I'm an I'm asleep moment.
Speaker D:Because it's very obvious that the guy who happened.
Speaker D:The bench is faster selling martes, like six of the slowest players in baseball this year.
Speaker D:And now as the tying run, you just leave them out.
Speaker D:Like, it just.
Speaker D:That seems like such a layup.
Speaker D:Such an obvious, like, reflex instinct that wasn't taken.
Speaker C:Which didn't.
Speaker D:Don't question Carlos Mendoza.
Speaker D:But it was the first time where I thought like, oh, that was a.
Speaker D:There's no explanation behind this one.
Speaker A:What are the bench coaches?
Speaker A:Like, what's going on?
Speaker D:That's a good question, right?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, the guy was a player spits nails.
Speaker A:I mean, he's not a quiet guy.
Speaker A:That's not why he's there.
Speaker A:I mean, they're not having this conversation.
Speaker D:In the flow of that game.
Speaker D:And after a couple days before it, I mean, at least watching it, I felt shocked that that hit went in the gap from Starling Martha.
Speaker D:So I understand maybe again, like peeing asleep.
Speaker D:If there's ever a moment to be asleep.
Speaker D:Like, I felt like I was sleeping.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker D:Most of that game.
Speaker D:That's kind of.
Speaker D:That's kind of what it felt like to me for a degree or I was just like, can't believe.
Speaker D:It's like, oh, now he's throwing out.
Speaker D:Like, wait a second.
Speaker D:You should have been trans.
Speaker D:Like, I don't know.
Speaker D:It was a sleepy moment.
Speaker D:But, well, being asleep after those two games, like, I was asleep.
Speaker A:Any.
Speaker A:Any coach, basketball, baseball, football, whatever it is, assistant coaches jobs are to be thinking ahead for the manager.
Speaker A:And I'll tell you if.
Speaker A:I mean, Chris, he can tell you.
Speaker A:What was his answer as to why he didn't.
Speaker A:I mean, I know he said something about that.
Speaker B:He never thought about it.
Speaker D:Marte's a good runner.
Speaker A:Yeah, Marte.
Speaker D:Definitely in that play.
Speaker D:Marseille did everything.
Speaker A:The guys had knee problems.
Speaker A:What, are you kidding?
Speaker D:Of course.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker D:No, the entire.
Speaker D:Tyrone Taylor's the flash Yeah, I mean.
Speaker A:Why else have them on the.
Speaker A:Yeah, I mean he's.
Speaker B:Well, I think we're now at the Rockers also.
Speaker D:It's even more upsetting because then you look back at Tuesday, Monday, whatever day the first game was against the Guardians and Tyrone Taylor is the pinch where it's like, how do you.
Speaker D:How did we get both of these wrong?
Speaker D:Like in the aggregate, 50, 50 things.
Speaker D:Like you got to get one, you don't get the other one, then you win one of those games.
Speaker D:Like every game is Brewer series.
Speaker B:And I know he's got a back.
Speaker D:If you make half the right plays, you sweep the series.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I know he's such a wisdom.
Speaker D:Series just do everything wrong.
Speaker B:He's got to back his coaches up.
Speaker B:So he's going to say 100% he would have been out of the plate or oh, he made the right decision and not sending them.
Speaker B:If they send him this losing streak, number one is not seven games.
Speaker B:But I think that makes a huge difference in that series against the Guardians.
Speaker B:Changes, you know, the way, the way things are flowing for the Mets and I think, you know, at this point they're just fishing to see offensively who they're going to put up there.
Speaker B:But my, my question to you is we're at like 53, 54 straight games without getting two different pitchers to go six plus innings in a start.
Speaker B:You know, what's the next, like, how do we get guys to be on his team?
Speaker B:Maybe we just don't have that this year.
Speaker B:You know, Shamani is not ready.
Speaker B:He hits a wall every time.
Speaker B:He's not ready for that.
Speaker B:Kodai Sanga's not ready for that.
Speaker B:David Peterson is the one guy Frankie Montas doesn't even start for us anymore.
Speaker B:And you know, we're going to be bringing back Paul Blackburn, who they haven't even given him an idea of what he's doing.
Speaker B:So what is the next step and how do you get these guys to.
Speaker B:To put out more than four innings?
Speaker D:I, I think that is a.
Speaker C:Is a.
Speaker D:It's slightly an unsolvable problem at this point in the season.
Speaker D:It's just you kind of got.
Speaker D:That's what got like talked about the beginning here.
Speaker D:And I was like a lot of his bad performance, a lot of his bad luck, like, you shoot for like half of these guys being able to do that by this time of year.
Speaker C:The way they went into the season.
Speaker D:The fact that you can't get that from either Minio or Sanga, the guys who are kind of presumed to Be the top two guys in the staff.
Speaker D:They both got hurt.
Speaker D:They both dealt with some stuff that's just like.
Speaker D:Still, it's like a big part of the team was predicated, at least one of those guys to be something like that.
Speaker D:And the fact that it's neither of them, it's like you.
Speaker D:Unless they want to bring up one of these kids, which it seems like they might based on all the shuffling they did today with Joe and Tom going aaa, guys going Triple A.
Speaker A:But I didn't even see that.
Speaker D:Yeah, they put on tongs up, Ewing's up, Clifford's up.
Speaker D:And then there was a couple others.
Speaker D:The big.
Speaker D:They did like a big up.
Speaker D:A big.
Speaker D:A big double up from.
Speaker D:So then maybe Syracuse.
Speaker D:That seems like.
Speaker D:To bring Joe and Tom to that rotation.
Speaker D:Clearly someone's going to leave that rotation.
Speaker D:It's kind of the idea.
Speaker D:But also, you can't really expect one of those guys to come up with this year either.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker D:You had to bring those guys up.
Speaker C:Oh, whoa.
Speaker D:Wow.
Speaker D:On the street here.
Speaker D:Holy crap, you're right.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:I got motorcycle right in front of me.
Speaker A:Oh, my goodness.
Speaker D:No.
Speaker D:I'm sorry.
Speaker D:He was blaring the thing like a jerk.
Speaker B:But okay, you have to get.
Speaker D:You had to build those guys up slowly over the last two months if you want them to do in the stretch run now.
Speaker D:They're kind of close to their own innings limits.
Speaker D:They've been pitching with a six man rotation the whole year.
Speaker D:Aaa.
Speaker C:It's like you can't really expect more.
Speaker D:Than like what Frankie Matas is doing right now from one of those guys.
Speaker D:I just see.
Speaker C:Give him a little bit.
Speaker D:They bite that off, they can chew it, then you can give them more.
Speaker D:It's like, that's just.
Speaker D:I don't know.
Speaker D:It seemed like such an easy answer in June to let one of those guys be like this kind of bulk sponge kind of guy.
Speaker D:Like we saw DL hall do today for the brewers on Sunday.
Speaker D:It's.
Speaker D:They have tried.
Speaker D:Neither of them there.
Speaker D:It's kind of like, oh, that was a mess.
Speaker B:Well, I think, you know, right now it's the.
Speaker B:It's the bats.
Speaker B:I mean, who's the biggest disappointment for the Mets at the plate?
Speaker C:Is it.
Speaker B:Is it Lindor?
Speaker D:Is it definitely Lindor?
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:I feel like it's not even close.
Speaker D:Right.
Speaker B:I just think that it's a bad season.
Speaker D:It's objectively a bad season from a guy that came to second place National League MVP last year.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker D:But I just think people talk about the regression.
Speaker D:It's like, that's a big part of this team's aggression this year.
Speaker B:The hard part is, you know, as a manager, he tries to leave him up in the top of the lineup, but he's killing him.
Speaker B:But the other guy that's absolutely destroying them is Brandon Nemo.
Speaker B:You got your three hitter bunting today because he's, because he's striking out 50 of the time.
Speaker B:You know, it's, there's just too many holes in the lineup and I think you got to try to just put your best players in the top five.
Speaker B:Whoever it is that.
Speaker D:Who do you think that is?
Speaker D:That.
Speaker B:I mean, what do you change?
Speaker D:No one's hitting up and down the hall.
Speaker D:I mean, I, I, Mauricio and Alvarez a little bit more, but like, I don't.
Speaker D:McNeil, I guess you can make him the two guy again.
Speaker D:Maybe, I don't know.
Speaker D:But it's still just like they might.
Speaker B:Have, they might have to take a grasp and bring up a guy straight from, you know, from Double A and Carson bench.
Speaker B:I don't know, they might have to do something crazy because it's not going to be Cedric Mullins.
Speaker D:No, he's not in that poorly.
Speaker D:Like it's, in terms of, it's funny, the deadline stuff.
Speaker D:It's like, I know Helzer blew the game today, but you go five straight innings against another team's bullpen, you don't score runs.
Speaker D:Like you have to get insurance for the guys.
Speaker D:Just, I don't know, it's all gonna happen at once if it does happen because like there's no teeny tiny little tweak at this point.
Speaker C:They're just kind of broken.
Speaker C:Yep.
Speaker B:Hopefully it changes.
Speaker A:Well, you can hear the exasperation in everybody's voice.
Speaker A:James Ciano, thanks so much.
Speaker A:Hopefully we have you on next time and it's a little happier conversation.
Speaker B:Thank you, guys.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:Thanks to James.
Speaker A:Thanks to Mickey Calloway.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And one night, hopefully things change for the Yankees and the Mets and we can talk about something positive in two weeks.
Speaker A:And we will definitely for you football people out there, NFL and NCAA football coming up will be hitting that soon.
Speaker A:Thanks to Brian Graves behind the glass, as always.
Speaker A:We'll see in a couple weeks.
Speaker A:Cap, thanks so much and keep the faith.
Speaker B:All right, let's go.
Speaker A:Have a good one, everybody.
Speaker A:Management or owners of WGB.
